Hi everyone,
long time ago someone asked me if it would be possible to aerialize a serious high amount of line without ticking.
I tried it and it wasn't possible for me.
Then I started to check with other casters.
Very soon I concluded that the line dangle mostly (almost always) will result in ticking with long carries.
As soon as one will cast on grass of just 5 inch in length one will see how the max carry decreases cause ticking in such catchy grass ruins the cast.
It took a while to get other instructors listening. Almost nobody wanted to listen about this topic. :p
A whole bunch of great casters told me not to tick at all. But videos and watching them in truth showed a different picture to me. Simply they all ticked down, like I did myself.
However there are still doubts left with quiet some instructors/casters. I often heard the argument if one would tick on water the cast would collapse.
And I absolutely don't agree here!
Here is a picture showing the line dangle of a very good caster (Lasse Karlsson) on a distance shoot.
If the fluff+leader would tick here I understand this not to be a problem for the cast cause there is lots of non straight line to be straightened. That means there would be time for the fluff to jump up again. And that is what I see in slomos.
Does that make sense or am I still wrong at all?
Greets
Bernd
And why wouldn't a tick on water cause the cast to fail?
Just home from a competition in Sweden, distance casts where with water in the BC, everyone who ticked lost distance, and control if it was during falscasting... Line was just a short belly guideline highwater, but most carried above 20 meters regardless...
A good friend of mine, and one of the best flycasters I know once got the remark while we where casting at a gathering. What do you do if you where standing hip deep in water? He was carrying a full DT outside the tip and the line dangle passed below hip level...
Reply was the logical answer, increase speed.....
Oh, I once heard the remark that no caster can carry serious amounts of line witout their loops getting too open and the casts failing... Quite sure it is true, I can't carry 50 meters witout that happening :p
Hi Lasse,
in 99% of all casters I have been casting with the fluff ticked down way before being at their max carries. I would say above 22-23m (line hand to fluff) it happened.
If you look at the picture I added in my first posting and think of where the water was in your linked video... The fluff easily might tick in front of the pool.
I once linked a very nice video of Ian Walker casting at the ponds of the Golden Gate platforms in SF.
The video showed ticking on every single forward cast without causing any problems. Well, here on the board I got no replies at all at that time.
Why do you think the cast would collaps if the fly ticks down slightly?
Maybe we have to meet and try to find out why we can't get on the same page here?
I think on the field we will be on your or mine page within a minute.
Greets
Bernd
p.s.: How did both of you do in the competition?
Yeah I disagreed with Bernd too. And he had me on it until I brought in the tractor. No ticks while standing on a tractor. You have to work hard to stay ahead in this game.
If I tick the water, my cast stuffs up. Unless a lot of line hits on grass I have little impact on my delivery. In the old days of tournament casting there was a judge placed behind the caster to call "ticks" on the water. If the fly/leader/line "ticked" the water on the delivery cast, the call was "no score". Boy did that focus the mind.
My distance cast often ticks beside me on the forward delivery with a full line. The fluff actually travels down and up almost vertically. This doesn't happen on a platform (or tractor). And I was unaware of it until Bernd pointed it out - now I hear it!
It comes down to the transverse wave created on these distance casts. I never looked for it before, at least not beside me. Bernd can be a bit annoying like that
Things are great downunder. Doing plenty of casting practice. Have initiated a study of distance casting from a bio-mechanical viewpoint and am half way through the program at end of March. Very interesting indeed. Amazing that what you think you are doing is not quite what is actually happening. I always knew speed was king and it does not come from the arm but I did not realise how slow I had become. Suppose that happens at my age but to record rod speed over time and identify the causal issues of increases in rod speed has been both interesting and challenging. I hope to get over to Fagernes for a day or two and we can share some thoughts.
Hi John,
Paul has explained it pretty well. The picture I linked above shows how the fluff can travel upwards almost vertical. And it is that what works on water, too.
I checked myself on water and before focusing on the ticks I too never would have thought to tick. I simply never realized it.
It happens so fast (high line speed on huge lengths of line) that I simply don't see it without concentrating on it.
The physics are the same for all of us and we all have the dangle on huge carries.
Ok, we can vary it's shape for some degree and we can vary speed to some degree. Besides that Steve Rajeff has dangling ends, too.
I once was told in an instructor exam (while being the candidate) that the 170 style was a very bad choice for aerializing a huge carry cause it made me tick all the time.
I disagreed cause I think the 170 style simply is a very effective style to aerilize one's max carry .
The key point was that ticking happens independend of the style one chooses but simply based on gravity and line length (length of carry).
Greets
Bernd
p.s.: Well in case of a better understanding I like to be a bit annoying. :p
I do know why it sometimes tick, that isn't the question, and contrary to Paul, have been aware for alot longer, I don't care where it doesn't hurt, only when it does.
Even a light tick hurts, and when you compete with af fence behind like at cla, you really need to be able to keep event af long carry up.
You should ask yourself why you are so keen on the ticking and not the reasons behind it
Lasse Karlsson wrote:You should ask yourself why you are so keen on the ticking and not the reasons behind it
hi Bernd !
i totally agree with Lasse. yes, it does indeed happen but ticking is not a 'rule' as you seem to think.
(and one doesn't need a tractor either... :p )
if you need hard-core proof, film casts with water not only behind the caster, but the whole length of the cast on the caster's side. no possible doubts there.
Hi Marc,
how about explaining HOW you avoid ticking on long carries?
I don't need a proof. I would like someone to explain, cause yet simply nobody did.
Greets
Bernd
Bernd wrote:Hi Marc,
how about explaining HOW you avoid ticking on long carries?
I don't need a proof. I would like someone to explain, cause yet simply nobody did.
Greets
Bernd
Hi Bernd
You told me, about a year ago, that you learned to tick at will at different distances, so you should already know how to avoid it
And I actually did on page one, but you might have missed it...
:p
